tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post7481362335542775301..comments2024-03-29T02:43:11.575-04:00Comments on Jungle Red Writers: The Mystery of HistoryJungle Red Writershttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16646429819267618412noreply@blogger.comBlogger57125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-911879055464638552015-03-20T14:55:05.048-04:002015-03-20T14:55:05.048-04:00Oh my gosh. I'm sorry to admit I hadn't h...Oh my gosh. I'm sorry to admit I hadn't heard of this, yet another dark chapter in the government- and church-sanctiioned wars against the powerless in Canada. But as soon as I read the words Duplessis and Orphans together, I got a chill within me. <br /><br />I've got a bit of reading to do. Thanks, Jeannette.Susan Dhttp://www.susandaly.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-31382036228195387562015-03-19T23:23:31.538-04:002015-03-19T23:23:31.538-04:00Jeannette--you are fabulous..what a wonderful day....Jeannette--you are fabulous..what a wonderful day. Come back and tell us about your new book, okay?<br /><br />See you all tomorrow..oxoHank Phillippi Ryanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17420701704169428286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-89925740369546714722015-03-19T20:22:51.953-04:002015-03-19T20:22:51.953-04:00Hank, the teacher is sending me an email this week...Hank, the teacher is sending me an email this week, and I'm hoping he'll advise me as to what the students are currently working on and reading. It's my granddaughter's class, and they were recently working on a short story, but I'm not sure if they still are. One of the points I want to make is to know what the purpose of your writing is, really basic, but having worked with teens before, it's an aspect of writing that they can become confused over. Writing a persuasive piece has a different purpose than a fiction piece. If the teacher doesn't have a specific type of writing or area of writing he wants me to address, I'm just going to talk about such basics as organization, word choice (words to avoid, confusing words, descriptive words), point of view, and some essential punctuation. It's an honors class, so I can expect a certain level of comparable skill, which helps. <br /><br />Oh, and Kristopher, I bought Eight ages ago, and I've never gotten around to reading it. I guess it needs to get back on my TBR list.Kathy Reelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17004247271452356577noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-10084765417414579542015-03-19T16:15:56.072-04:002015-03-19T16:15:56.072-04:00And yes, they don't feel like "historical...And yes, they don't feel like "historical details," right? They're simply the story. Hank Phillippi Ryanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17420701704169428286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-82421258825462057522015-03-19T16:06:15.737-04:002015-03-19T16:06:15.737-04:00Leslie, Hank, me, too! I'm loving this convers...Leslie, Hank, me, too! I'm loving this conversation... thanks to everyone for sharing!Jeannette de Beauvoirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02308284502164683088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-7997781854023561442015-03-19T15:48:16.502-04:002015-03-19T15:48:16.502-04:00Oh, what a smart way to think about history in a n...Oh, what a smart way to think about history in a novel -- that the challenge isn't "getting it right" but in triggering a conversation between past and present. <br /><br />Loving the glimpses of the past in the comments -- in personal stories and in novels in progress!Leslie Budewitzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11942314846112875042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-74141408492035862122015-03-19T15:22:18.084-04:002015-03-19T15:22:18.084-04:00Jeannette, you are so brave to be here on a work d...Jeannette, you are so brave to be here on a work day! <br /><br />Crossing fingers for the plot hole--it is so rewarding to figure it out! <br /><br />Oh, that's a great question, Pat D. More to come..xoxoHank Phillippi Ryanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17420701704169428286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-69684921583403406842015-03-19T15:16:29.875-04:002015-03-19T15:16:29.875-04:00For me, at least, it comes back to the story. If t...For me, at least, it comes back to the story. If the story is entertaining enough, and the characters are interesting enough, then I think readers will stick through historical details they'd rather in the normal course of events not know about.Jeannette de Beauvoirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02308284502164683088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-59175368218914339612015-03-19T15:05:12.846-04:002015-03-19T15:05:12.846-04:00I've enjoyed reading everyone's posts so m...I've enjoyed reading everyone's posts so much. We all enjoy a lot of authors in common. Do you find it difficult to walk the tightrope between being PC (a term and condition I am starting to hate) and historically accurate though possibly distasteful?Pat Dnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-385394573970126712015-03-19T14:40:19.799-04:002015-03-19T14:40:19.799-04:00Loved Name of the Rose.
And I still have a plot h...Loved Name of the Rose.<br /><br />And I still have a plot hole to fill! Promise I'll come back and chat more, though, when it's in!Jeannette de Beauvoirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02308284502164683088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-65957949263317357752015-03-19T14:11:59.697-04:002015-03-19T14:11:59.697-04:00Love to know more about your workshops!But you can...Love to know more about your workshops!But you can tell us in two and a half weeks. Good luck--PLENTY of time, right?<br /><br />(My copyedits are due TOMORROW. I am now having fun with hyphens.)<br /><br />Okay, back to our original programming…<br /><br />Kristopher--The Eight! I haven't thought about that for a while--briliant. And Name of the Rose.Hank Phillippi Ryanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17420701704169428286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-13162483123530376402015-03-19T13:25:38.934-04:002015-03-19T13:25:38.934-04:00Great idea…I need to find out what they're rea...Great idea…I need to find out what they're reading now, too..Hank Phillippi Ryanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17420701704169428286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-86533454610736872332015-03-19T13:01:12.730-04:002015-03-19T13:01:12.730-04:00When you're teaching kids, try and think less ...When you're teaching kids, try and think less about "writing" and more about "storytelling." Writing sounds scary: it has rules, there are great writers to live up to, etc. Whereas everyone can tell a story. Make it about the stories and kids generally respond.<br />Jeannette de Beauvoirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02308284502164683088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-72668027910006408282015-03-19T12:57:50.864-04:002015-03-19T12:57:50.864-04:00Kathy, we have construction guys, too, ripping dow...Kathy, we have construction guys, too, ripping down our ice-soaked ceiling in the entry way. I'll be glad when that is..history.<br /><br />(And I have to give a high school writing class soon..I am terrified. Any ideas?)Hank Phillippi Ryanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17420701704169428286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-40953888032731716552015-03-19T12:56:00.042-04:002015-03-19T12:56:00.042-04:00(And Rhys, so right about the evil motives! I love...(And Rhys, so right about the evil motives! I love it...)<br /><br />Jeannette de Beauvoirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02308284502164683088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-57387625546899949852015-03-19T12:54:14.175-04:002015-03-19T12:54:14.175-04:00Bathroom renovations! Eek! Poor Kathy!
I do teach...Bathroom renovations! Eek! Poor Kathy!<br /><br />I do teach writing via workshops, both here on Cape Cod and online; and I have long-delayed plans to start a blog on my website. I promise to do in in two and a half weeks (when my current manuscript is due at St. Martin's and I have a chance to breathe!)<br /><br /><br />So glad to hear about other series and authors ... I can't imagine anything I'd rather do than delve into them!Jeannette de Beauvoirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02308284502164683088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-8762987151587700382015-03-19T12:48:28.015-04:002015-03-19T12:48:28.015-04:00My favorite line from your piece is "any writ...My favorite line from your piece is "any writing that incorporates history is, essentially, a conversation between the past and the present." As Joan pointed out, it's a "marvelous description." (I stopped here to read through the rest of the comments, and, apparently, that line resonated with everyone.) Allowing the voices of the past to make themselves known in the present makes for fascinating writing, and while I enjoy both period stories and stories encompassing the present and the past, I delight in the secrets of a long ago past coming to light and affecting the present. Of course, even in a period mystery, those secrets that are so essential to solving the puzzle are in the past, albeit recent past. Kristopher mentioned Diana Gabaldon's Outlander series and my love of it. This series attacks the mysteries of the past by time travel, my favorite method of bringing past and present together. Although not mysteries, the Outlander series does bring that modern knowledge to the events of the past, which is so delicious. And, there's the whole issue of not doing anything to change history in time travel. <br /><br />One area of history offering answers for the present that I've come to really enjoy is anthropological forensics. Elly Griffiths in her Ruth Galloway mystery series with Ruth being an archeologist intrigues me, as well as newer authors Jen J. Danna and Ann Vaderlaan in their Abbott and Lowell mystery series, which has a forensic anthropologist as a main character. The secrets that old bones hold set me all a tingle.<br /><br />Of course, Rhys and Susan are masters at historical fiction mystery with the characters set in the period of examination. As Hank's teacher stated that history is stories, I feel I learn so much history from these amazing stories, and I get my love of mysteries satisfied, too. Talk about the complete package!<br /><br />Jeannette, in reading your piece here, I kept thinking that I would love to sit in on a writing course taught by you. I'm not an author, but I do play one on TV. Sorry, I couldn't resist that line. Seriously, I'm not an author, but I do write a blog and reviews, and I've worked with students on writing, so I found everything (not an exaggeration) you said so relevant to writing, not just historical mysteries, but writing in general. I'm set to talk to some 8th graders about writing soon, and your post gave me some ideas about point of view to jot down. Do you have a blog or more articles that I could access? <br /><br />You have hooked me on your musings and your new book. I will be reading Asylum! It appeals to me on the historical fiction and mystery levels, but it also appeals to me in the subject matter. Insane asylums of the past are horrifyingly interesting, and the placement of perfectly sane people in them is worth reflection. I just finished a book by Anna Lee Huber, Mortal Arts, in which a man spent ten years in an asylum in the early 1800s because of war trauma, not insanity, and it was his father who put him there. The Vanishing of Esme Lennox by Maggie O'Farrell is set in the 1930s and present, and it addresses the power of one's family over admitting females who didn't conform to such terrible institutions. A nonfiction book that I have only spot read is The Lives They Left Behind in which suitcases of residents left in the attic of the New York’s 120-plus-year-old mental institution Willard State Hospital were examined after the institution was closed down in 1995. <br /><br />Thank you for visiting Jungle Reds today, Jeannette, and providing such an interesting post. As I sit here listening to my bathroom renovator sledgehammering the walls, your post was a most welcome respite. Kathy Reelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17004247271452356577noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-22122193422374955062015-03-19T12:45:20.117-04:002015-03-19T12:45:20.117-04:00Jeanette, looking forward to reading this. I did a...Jeanette, looking forward to reading this. I did a lot of research on the New York asylum for one of the Molly books and found it took only the signature of a husband and one doctor to have a woman committed for life. Such an easy way to get rid of an unwanted wife and acquire her fortune.<br /><br />That's why I enjoy writing historicals. So many deliciously evil motives.Rhysnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-43222288237064366012015-03-19T12:07:46.681-04:002015-03-19T12:07:46.681-04:00Mark, that's what a lot of people seem to thin...Mark, that's what a lot of people seem to think. Actually, the word history comes from the Old French "estoire," from Latin "historia," and from Greek "historia," all of which have slightly different meanings but which work together to give the English *its* meaning of a collection of past events.Jeannette de Beauvoirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02308284502164683088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-2487155286458418982015-03-19T11:41:05.939-04:002015-03-19T11:41:05.939-04:00Deborah, thanks for commenting... and I agree. Let...Deborah, thanks for commenting... and I agree. Letters are extraordinarily interesting, once you can step beyond the differences of how people expressed themselves in past eras. Jeannette de Beauvoirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02308284502164683088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-39869920935473705102015-03-19T11:38:16.246-04:002015-03-19T11:38:16.246-04:00Hank, that's why I get so many complaints abou...Hank, that's why I get so many complaints about my book. I tried so hard to be true to the time period, and it really offended a lot of readers - the way my characters are so ruthless when it comes to appropriating Cambodian culture. I hate it when writers impose their modern morality on their historical characters! Even if a historical figure was an exception to the rule, they were still of their time period, and being an exception during that time period is very different from having the hindsight of modern life. Kimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15354719566758459929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-80675391252318152122015-03-19T11:36:03.266-04:002015-03-19T11:36:03.266-04:00I love both - novels set in the past and novels th...I love both - novels set in the past and novels that need to dig into the past to solve the present. I wish I read my historical fiction, in fact, because history fascinates me.<br /><br />(And Hank, I learned that it was history because it was His story, meaning God's story. Granted, I learned this in a Christian school, so I don't know if that is why it is called history or not, but that is the only explanation I've ever heard for why it is called history.)Mark Bakerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11567392254011373198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-80612546584044786242015-03-19T11:33:33.265-04:002015-03-19T11:33:33.265-04:00Jeanette, what a fascinating story. So eager to he...Jeanette, what a fascinating story. So eager to hear how you've worked it into a mystery. I love both entirely historical and contemporary/historical novels and, having written several of the latter, can sympathize over the timeline issues!<br /><br />I read non-fiction history, too, and particularly like diaries and letters. So very useful if you're trying to get an authentic feel for the period. "Few Eggs and No Oranges: Vere Hodson's Diary 1940-1945", was my favorite source when I was writing Where Memories Lie, part of which takes place in London during that period.Deborah Crombiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16988750789088153601noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-10628889095809658552015-03-19T11:00:32.830-04:002015-03-19T11:00:32.830-04:00Filters will always be there.
They might come fr...Filters will always be there. <br /><br />They might come from our own era, or our political beliefs, or our religious ones, or our personal issues. <br /><br />Historians talk about that all the time. Remember that history is always written by the winners, the people in power, who have their own filters as well.<br /><br />See for example the ongoing controversy over Richard III and the princes in the tower. Respected historians have made the case for both sides (yes he killed them, no he didn't kill them). The extant material can "prove" both arguments. So when even historians cannot get it "right" one has to understand that there probably is no such thing as getting it "right."<br /><br />Jeannette de Beauvoirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02308284502164683088noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-9320437490180743372015-03-19T10:46:52.061-04:002015-03-19T10:46:52.061-04:00Oh, so interesting, and I'm fascinated by that...Oh, so interesting, and I'm fascinated by that, Kathleen. is there even a way for contemporary writers not to filter the past through the present?Hank Phillippi Ryanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17420701704169428286noreply@blogger.com