DEBORAH CROMBIE: The last several times What We're Writing has rolled around, I've sworn that Kincaid/James #20 was ALMOST finished and that the next time I checked in, I'd be able to show you a neatly typed THE END.
But, no, alas, I am still writing.
The pages are piling up (yes, I do still print manuscript pages, because I always find mistakes in printed copy that I don't see on the screen, and as a "just in case" because even though I back up regularly, digital catastrophes do happen.) I still use the manuscript format I was taught as a very newbie writer, Courier, double-spaced, twenty-five lines a page, which averages 250 words a page. My current page count is 503, or roughly 125 thousand words, and I am imagining the publisher's horror as they are calculating the cost of paper and printing–this is a very big deal.
And I am not finished.
Actually, this book is not all that long for me. The first draft of A KILLING OF INNOCENTS clocked in at 650 pages, which my then-editor happily slashed by a hundred pages, I'm sure making it a much better book in the process. WATER LIKE A STONE was long, as was NECESSARY AS BLOOD, but GARDEN OF LAMENTATIONS takes the cake–it was so long that my editor said it should have been two books, and it is my longest published book to date.
I suspect this current book has another 50 or so pages to go, and then we'll see what comes out in the wash, so to speak. It's pretty terrifying, I have to admit, working with a new editor and not really knowing what to expect.
It's also scary, so close to the end, to wonder if the finished book will live up to that "Platonic book" I first conceived. I've filled three spiral notebooks with notes, and now I'm wondering what bits of all those ideas I've left out. And there are so many series characters I love that I just couldn't squeeze into this book–not unless I want it to run double that 500 pages!
I am excited to be so close to the end, and frustrated that I can't write it faster.
And now for some really good news!
Kincaid/James #20 is scheduled for publication in Winter '27! I don't have the exact date yet, but things are moving fast. Cover art is in the works!
And it looks like my working title is going to stand, so the book is called
THE LONG COLD SLEEP
You can see I'm really under the gun!
Dear Reds and readers, how do you feel about long books? I know you can get away with really long novels in sci-fi and fantasy, and in historical fiction or family sagas, but how do you like your crime novels? I worry that if a book isn't long enough, my readers will feel cheated.
I can't imagine any reader feeling "cheated" by one of your books, Debs . . . .
ReplyDeleteHowever many pages it takes to tell the story, I'm good with it. I don't really think about long or short, just that the story gets told in a satisfying manner. Now I'm looking forward to reading "The Long Cold Sleep" . . . .
Aw, thank you, Joan! That is so kind!
DeletePlease never stop writing!!!
ReplyDeleteI agree 100% with Anonymous here! Please, Deb’s, never stop writing!
DeleteThanks, Anon and Suzette. I hope my publisher feels the same! Honestly, I can't imagine NOT writing. I might not do it as fast as I'd like, but the stories are always playing in my head.
DeleteI just finished reading the 897 page The Hallmarked Man, 8th book in the Cormoran Strike series so I am in when it comes to long books. I wasn’t all that impressed with the very thin paper of the pages, small font size, and light print color which I assume were all cost saving measures. But then again, the hardcover was heavy enough with the thin paper.
ReplyDeleteTell the story you need to tell and don’t worry about the page or word count.
Oh, Brenda, I mentioned The Hallmarked Man below. I listened to the Audible version and also bought on Kindle, so I think for the first time I didn't buy the hardcover. My daughter did, though, and she mentioned the quality of paper was not great. Publisher cost cutting, for sure.
DeleteI can be daunted by long books - I've had Margaret Atwood's memoir on my coffee table for six months and haven't opened it. But your books, Debs? I know I won't be able to put it down, so long won't scare me off.
ReplyDeleteEdith, I would be(and have been) daunted by non-fiction books of great length. But not as often as I’ve come to the last page of a favorite series book and wished for “just another chapter”…just as a child pleas for just one more bedtime story. Elisabeth
DeleteThanks so much, Edith!!
DeleteLoved Margaret Atwood’s memoir!! It IS long, but so reflective of her wit - of course.
DeleteAnd I cannot imagine one of Deb Crombie’s books being to long, I consume her stories with great gusto! And was surprised when she said Garden of Lamentations was long….
(Heather S)
OMG, Debs,, I am stoked that you are close to typing "the end." Did you tell us before that you have a new editor? I hope it is someone who realizes that some stories take longer to tell. THE GARDEN OF LAMENTATIONS is brilliant, certainly one of my favorites. In it, Kinkaid finally solves underlying mysteries that had been going for several books.
ReplyDeleteIn truth, your books aren't even long enough because I am always sorry to get to the end. That isn't always the case with authors, but your books are all story, not filler.
Winter 2027? January or February? Yes? Can't wait!!
Thanks, Judy! Not sure about the month, but will post as soon as they tell me. And I do have a new editor, who is lovely and has been so patient with me. I'm looking forward to seeing what she thinks about the finished book. She says she loves it so far!
DeleteAgree with all these comments Debs! We're cheering you on. I admit that I've had Wally Lamb's latest on my pile for a long time, partly because I know the opening will be hard. But I also know it will be worth it once I dive in. I can't wait for every page of yours!
ReplyDeleteThank you, dear Lucy! You and our fellow Reds are my cheering squad! I can't imagine doing this without you!
DeleteBecause I have always been a fast reader, long books were never an issue, and I didn't understand how they could be. Until I joined a book club, and realized how many people can take a month to read a single book. However, as Edith points out, long nonfiction had better be fascinating, or I will really drag my feet on finishing it. Of course that's true with short nonfiction, as well. I recently read Lorne, about Lorne Michaels, the genius behind Saturday Night Live, and was astonished to realize it was 750 pages. It was that riveting.
ReplyDeleteIf a story is a good one, as your Kinkaid/James books always are, Debs, long is better, as far as I'm concerned, with one caveat. So many books could be edited to read more tightly. None of the Reds' books, but there are authors I won't read because they are lazily edited and indulged in their verbosity.
Karen, a once favorite author follows every bit of backstory until the bitter end. Each new book is longer than the last. I skim them to find out what's happening with characters I care about and to read the end.
DeleteFlora, I've experienced that as a reader, and it made me determined to NOT make the same mistake in my own fiction. As a reader, I don't need to hear about everything that's happened in the past books ("As you know, Bob, when my wife left me and my house burned down...") and, just as when I'm making friends in real life, I don't need to discover every aspect of a character's past all at once.
DeleteYes, I agree, Julia and Flora, but again the how much is too much backstory is such a juggling act. You don't want to bore series readers, but you do want to give new readers enough to clue them in. I confess I probably spend way too much time worrying about this and re-writing things.
DeleteKaren, thank you! And thanks for the top on the Lorne Michaels book. Did you read or listen?
DeleteIn terms of backstory, there's also a backstory to each subplot--and readers don't need every single one of these fleshed out. For the main characters in a book, sure, new readers need some backstory thrown in. But I think you Reds have got that balancing act down to a science--or should I say art?
DeleteHonestly, it depends on the author. Some of my faves are so riveting that it doesn't matter how long they are because I know the author will keep it moving and leave me satisfied. If it is a new-to-me author I am a bit more hesitant. Mentally, I do the math and figure I could read two or three other novels by the time I plowed through this long one. I find since I've hit my 70s that if the above criteria isn't met, I'll not venture into a long tome by a previously unknown-to-me author without glowing recommendations from folks I trust. Time is too precious and there are so many books that call to me. -- Victoria
ReplyDeleteI certainly agree with all that, Victoria. Reading time is precious.
DeleteI have to admit that I am always sorry when one of your books ends.
ReplyDeleteThank you, Maren. That's such a compliment.
DeleteI love your characters and am always sad when the book comes to an end, so please keep writing. The longer the better.
ReplyDeleteThank you, Carol! I am always sad when a book I'm writing comes to an end. There is a certain amount of story grief. But by the time it's been through edits, copy edits, and page proofs, I'm usually ready to let it go!
DeleteOh, I'm so excited. I do like long books. I do much of my "reading" through audio books, at least for my mysteries. If something is not at least 11 hours, I won't spend a credit on it! As Karen said, in terms of your books, the longer the better! Bring it on. (That said about audio books, I believe I've both read and listened to yours.)
ReplyDeleteBeth, that is so funny! That is my policy on the Audible credits, too! And I'm always very excited when a new book by a favorite author is 11 hours +! At the moment I've used all my credits on the full cast versions of the Harry Potter books, which are LONG (at least the later ones) and I am enjoying them so much. And so looking forward to the new Martha Wells Murderbot book, out next month and I have it pre-ordered. The narrator does such a great job with these.
DeleteI love a long book! Sadly it seems that the majority of books being published today are not generally as long. (I completely agree with you on reading printed pages vs on-screen for editing. It’s also more fun and satisfying to mark them up with my red pen!).
ReplyDeleteStacia, at least some of the preference for small books is financial. The pandemic supply chain issues hit printers hard, and the heavy tariffs on Canadian pulp wood makes paper much more expensive.
DeleteYes, as I mentioned, too, the cost of paper and printing these days takes a big bite out of the publisher's margins. My former editor still edited on paper, although she's have her assistant scan and send me the marked pages. It will be interesting to see how my new editor does things.
DeleteDebs, no matter the length of the book you are writing, I’m so looking forward to read it.
ReplyDeleteI was hoping it would be available for a signed copy at Bouchercon Calgary but at least it will become my birthday present to myself.
Thank you, Danielle!
DeleteI'm excited about your book! Woo hoo! So close to done. I actually love long books, especially by my favorite authors (you and other Reds, among others). There's a special kind of delight involved in opening and beginning a large book that I know I am going to enjoy. I anticipate hours of pleasure.
ReplyDeleteAnd so lovely if you can set aside time to enjoy an anticipated book and not have to read in bits and pieces. And thank you, Gillian!
DeleteFrom Celia: Oh, the joy and delight of a well anticipated story from an author whose work I
ReplyDeleteLove! Deb's it can't be too long for me. Surely the joys for the readers of fiction IS the story. Your story offed to us, your readers.
Size has suddenly taken over as a measure of "success or not as Edith mentions , suddenly Atwords book seems too much with all else swirling around.
I am both feeling and noticing such a change of current SM PACE. MEMES WHICH SETTLE AND ARE HARD TO DISTROY. Everything calling, me, me, look here. It takes energy to work over this ground and stay focused.
Deb's from how you structure your writing we know it works and we/I love it. Have a date just confirms your next joy is coming and will
be welcome by all.
Thank you, Celia! It is so hard to stay focused, with all the world/digital distractions. I am on a news fast until this book is finished, and have really been absent from social media except for my little Insta posts, which are a joy break in my day.
DeleteWinter of 2027 hooray! As soon as we can preorder I’ll be ordering from The Silver Unicorn Bookstore, my local! Long books might daunt me but that would never be the reason I would not read a book. And Debs, you know we all here would read your books no matter how long. Good luck with your new editor!
ReplyDeleteThank you, Suzette!! And, yes, please, everyone support your indie's if you can. I'm wondering if my wonderful neighborhood store would consider offering some signed copies? I'll have to ask.
DeleteDeb’s, I’m certain your local bookstore would love signed copies! Suzette
DeleteFollow your own writing path, Deborah--the results are always engaging and leave us impatiently waiting for another book. There's never any filler--places where a reader might yawn, skip forward to where the plot picks up again and moves on. Fingers crossed that the new editor has read all of your books and understands your genius!!
ReplyDeleteOh, thank you, Flora, that's so sweet. It's got to be daunting for an editor to come into a series 19 books along, but I know she's read quite a few of them. And she has been a joy to work with.
DeleteI am so excited to know that I can look forward to another Deborah Crombie book in winter of '27. Hooray!!!
ReplyDeleteMy feelings about long books are complex, but seem similar to what many have already said. On the one hand, I have actually fallen so far behind in the Cormoran Strike series I may never catch up because back when I was working, those books just got so long that they daunted me. And even now, as Victoria said above, I sometimes look at a really long book and think, "I could enjoy three other books in the time I will invest in this." On the other hand, when the book is good enough, especially if it is by a reliably great author (like you, Debs) I barely notice the length. I am never going to NOT pick up one of your books, or one of Louise Penny's, for example, because of length. I suspect the more well established you are as an author, the less the length matters.
Susan, my daughter and I are big fans of the Cormoran Strike books, and I don't mind the length because I am always so immersed in their world. I think the latest one, The Hallmarked Man, might have been even long than usual, but I LOVED this one. She is such a great plotter. I listened to it on Audible--Robert Glennister is very good--and I had to listen to the last few chapters again just to make sure I got all the details.
DeleteAnd thank you!
Long or not long – depends on the author. I will name a few, so please bear with me. All are ‘serial authors’ meaning they either write continuous characters, or follow along the same subject line.
ReplyDeleteLouise Penny – will agree that she is getting close to her sell-by date, but still love her books. We listen to them in the car, where it is 4.5 hrs to and 4.5 hrs back to visit either kid. A book lasts two trips, with about an hour left over to read when we get home. Somehow, her stories seem to have a natural pause midway, which then begins again.
About to start Janet Skeslien Charles’ The Parisian Chapter. I enjoy her, but will no doubt think at the end – well that could have been an hour shorter. She like several authors seems to write a good book, and then hurries to tie it up. It reminds me of that little thing – ‘plan ahead’ where the lettering is crammed on the pages. Unfortunately, I find many long books follow this format. The first part is good, and then slam it goes together in a hurry – not enough pages allowed or have to finish it up in a hurry?
Debs and Julia – I just love your characters, as well as Ann Cleeves, Joy Ellis, and it used to be the spy series by Susan Elia MacNeal. All I can say is keep bringing them on, and I will continue to enjoy them.
Thanks, Margo!
DeleteThanks, Margo! I'm thrilled to be mentioned in such good company. And all authors who know how much is enough!
DeleteI gave up on one author whose books are now 600 pages long. Two books in one! With a crime, victim, couples drama, the kids, the pets, Melody and Doug, we need 400 pages to get it all sorted.
ReplyDeleteThat is about right, Margaret. I expect this one will land between 350 and 400 once it's typeset.
DeleteThe longer the better. I tend not to choose novellas, not enough bang for the buck.
ReplyDeleteAnd Deb, please, get that book finished. I don’t even buy green bananas!
Oh, Ann, you are going to outlast us all. And I promise it will be soon!!
DeleteI expect your books to be a long, delicious read coming back to the familiar characters and seeing what has been happening…I’ve read them all and I have never been disappointed!
ReplyDeleteThank you, Anon! I just wish I could get all my favorite characters into one book. I can hear them clamoring at the gates!
DeleteCongrats Debs. Looking forward to it! I must admit that if a mystery is too long, I take a sneak peek at the end (quelle horreurs).
ReplyDeleteI have been known to do it:-)
DeleteYay Debs! This is the best news! as for length of books, I don’t think page numbers matter, I think the story matters. A big fat book that’s a terrific story, that is the best of all worlds! But a big fat book that’s overstuffed or under edited becomes Instantly apparent. And a perfect doorstop.
ReplyDeleteDebs, your books are never doorstops!
Hank, the edited/not edited divide is THE difference. I read Stephen King's THE STAND, which was something like 700 pages when it first came out, but was tightly edited, without a single extraneous scene. Then a couple decades later, he released the ORIGINAL version, which was, of course, even longer - and boy, it made me appreciate his first editor so much. It wasn't the length. I'm delighted to sink into a long, long story! But if it's got a lot of flab that ought to be cut, it's no fun.
DeleteThank you, Hank. You are always so encouraging. And I agree with you and Julia on the edited/not edited issue. This is why good editors are gems beyond price, and I've been extremely fortunate with mine.
DeleteI've never actually managed to read a Stephen King novel! I know he's a big champion of tight writing, but whenever I've started one I've gotten immediately bogged down.
That is so true what you say about that it's the story that matters. I wasn't a much of a reader in high school but one day I picked up Gone With the Wind (Google says it's over 1,000 pages) and literally couldn't put it down. I was so caught up in Scarlet and Rhett's lives.
ReplyDeleteI still have my paperback copy somewhere, although the pages are probably too yellowed and the print to tiny to read. What a treasure that book is, but maybe a good one to reread on digital, or audio.
Delete"too" tiny. I should proofread before I hit publish!
DeleteI don’t mind a long book but agree that when it bogs down midway it makes me start flipping pages to get to the end. Can’t say that’s ever happened with one of your books, Debs!
ReplyDeleteThank you, Emily! And that is one of the drawbacks of reading e-books, I've found, is not really having a sense of where you are in the book.
DeleteIf any of you are Anthony Horowitz fans--I know Hank is--I'm struggling with The Marble Hall Murders. It seems like I've been reading forever and my Kindle says I still have 70% of the book to go. Should I stick it out?
On the other hand, I have started my copy of Jonelle Patrick's The Samurai's Octupus, and my daughter dropped off her hardcover copy of The Corresspondent this morning, so I have reading riches.
I'm smiling as I read the comments, Debs. In general, long contemporary novels can seem padded and repetitious, but your books are never that. I want to know how your continuing characters are doing, love hearing about the kids, and am always satisfied with the story. And - this must cause you to sigh - can't wait for the next one!
ReplyDeleteOh, no, Susan, that is absolutely the best thing you could say! I already have a lot of ideas for the next book and can't wait to talk to my lovely editor once she's got to the end of this one. Because there are continuing things... :-)
DeleteI don't care about the length as long as that story MOVES and I am engaged!
ReplyDeleteSame here, Pat. I positively look forward to long books if they are something I know I'll enjoy.
DeleteGood morning, everyone, and thank you SO much for all your lovely comments, which I read first thing. Apologies for being late to respond, but I had to get out first thing and do all the garden chores before it got too hot. We are going to be close to 90 today and it is very humid, so early out is essential. I also saw our first hummingbird, and our first black and blue swallowtail butterfly! And now I am settled down with my first cup of tea and looking forward to chatting.
ReplyDeleteIf I am enjoying a book then the longer the better, I don’t want it to end.
ReplyDeleteIf I see the left to read side is getting smaller and the story line is obviously coming to a conclusion and tying up the loose ends I am satisfied with that. If the additional pages don’t add anything new and are just descriptions serving no purpose then it becomes what does this have to do with actually learning anything else that is relevant and it is time for The End.
I do, however, like epilogues that may give additional insight or brings answers to questions that might hint at future relationships or whether there might be a sequel.
Oh epilogues. I agree, I do like them .
DeleteI do, too! It is a juggling act to wrap up a book with just enough wind down to be satisfying.
Delete90 degrees and high humidity. Not fun. Glad you're back inside with a nice cup of tea.
ReplyDeleteMe, too! If I get busy at the computer and don't get out until midday, I will regret it!
DeleteDeborah, thank you for all the writing … keep on giving us the gift of being part of Duncan’s and Gemma’s lives . Like Ann, the older I get the more I worry that my story will finish, before you finish writing the next book. Elisabeth
ReplyDeleteOh, thank you, Elizabeth.
DeleteDebs, I am just happy that you’re finishing up the book. I don’t care how long it is as long as it has our favorite characters and is written by you. If it won’t be published by Bouchercon in Calgary, maybe you can bring it to Left Coast Crime in Santa Fe in April ‘27? I’d love to be able to say hi in person again! — Pat S
ReplyDeleteI haven't made any plans for Calgary, as my book won't be out. But I hadn't realized Left Coast was in Santa Fe next year! What a terrific idea! I will definitely keep it on my radar.
DeleteYour books can be as long as you need them to be to tell your story. They are well written and the ending is always integrated, not a rushing race to tie up all the elements of the story.
ReplyDeleteYour series is the only one I have read again.
Generally, I find many books have a good first half and the second suffers in length and lack of cohesion in story development.
My daughter has read all of your books too. She generally reads fantasy and science fiction. She will be excited to read another of your books!
I’m in California and we have had over 90 since the first of March. I’m in central California, ten miles from the coast.
In spite of the heat my David Austen roses are thriving.
I look forward to hearing about your next book!
Susan, my David Austin's have had their first big bloom and now I need to get out there and fertilize!
DeleteWith my reading still being so slow because of focusing problems, I don't look forward to long books like I used to. However, my favorite authors, like you, Debs, aren't a daunting task at all. They are complete satisfaction. It just takes me a while longer than I like to read a long book now. I used to laugh when someone would mention reading a long book, maybe a book of 400 or 500 pages, because I've read Diana Gabaldon's Outlander series (one behind) that average 1,000 pages. It really does depend on the author and the story when committing to a long book.
ReplyDeleteI'm so glad glad you are still enjoying the books, Kathy.
DeleteDeb, some book clubs like to keep their choices closer to 400 pages or less, but, your readers will stick with it every book you write, no matter the page count. Can't wait to read it!
ReplyDeleteI don't think we'll go over that, but glad to know you'd read, regardless!
DeleteI did wonder why we hadn’t heard from you lately. I love, love all your books!! Cannot wait for #20!! Thank you so much for #1-19!
ReplyDeleteThank you, and thanks so much for reading!!
DeleteTrying to limit screen time in the evening so I've started re-reading the series. And yes, I can see the length has grown as I look at the space they take up on my bookshelf 😂 I seldom re-read but I'm very much enjoying getting reacquainted with one of my favorite series 📖
ReplyDeleteI'm really looking forward to your new book! I'm not concerned about length, especially since I know it happens because you're making a point of including a lot of secondary characters, which I love. You just keep doing you, and best of luck with the new editor!
ReplyDeleteI love long books, as long as the storyline is what is making it long. Sometimes books are made longer by describing every little thing in great detail and I don’t enjoy that. But if the detectives are having to go to new places and interview new people that help make the story more intriguing, the book can be very long! Especially if it’s in audiobook format for me!
ReplyDeleteFabulous, Debs! I'm thrilled to see you closing in on the finish line. I think the length really depends on the author and the story. I trust authors like yourself to tell the story in the amount of pages required. :)
ReplyDeleteThank you, Jenn!
DeleteHowever long it is, I’ll rejoice when it is published!
ReplyDeleteThank you!
DeleteI have your book pre ordered in Apple Books. For me the length of the book does not matter. However long it takes to tell the story of your characters and for us to enjoy it is all I care about. So happy to see this book will be available next year. So many of the authors I follow are no longer writing books or are writing the last in their series with no further books in the future. This is the part that makes me the saddest.
ReplyDeleteI didn't know the book was actually up for preorder with a pub date of 1/5/27! Yikes, no one told me, but that's very exciting! And thank you!!
DeleteLong or short. I love your books!!
ReplyDeleteThank you, Robin!!
DeleteDebs, I love your books! The length of the books depends on the story and the author. In your case, I always feel like there is closure at the end. Tough question for me. I used to be able to read 700 pages of fantasy. These days it’s rare for me to read beyond 350 pages. Again, it depends on the story and how the author writes the story.
ReplyDeleteI used to read those long fantasy novels, too, Diana, but I find these days I don't have quite as much patience.
DeleteThe longer the better, especially when it's characters I love. Anxiously waiting!
ReplyDelete=
Thank you, Kathy!!
DeleteUPDATE: It never occurred to me to check book sites, and nobody bothered to tell ME, but the pub date is 1/5/27 and A LONG COLD SLEEP is up for preorder everywhere! And there is a good synopsis, too!!
ReplyDeleteAnd I'd really better get back to work, LOL
Well that is certainly good news!
ReplyDeleteDeb, I love all your books and hate wen they end, so looong is great! Can't wait to read and then listen to it!
ReplyDeleteSo pleased to hear you're homing on the end of the new book. I've never felt that any of them were too long. Your stories and characters are so interesting, each read is a joy. Judy Kidder Browning
ReplyDelete