tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post3456585871425779426..comments2024-03-28T16:10:19.842-04:00Comments on Jungle Red Writers: Too Much Pink. Some insights into Gender Roles by Susan Elia MacNealJungle Red Writershttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16646429819267618412noreply@blogger.comBlogger50125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-79168824049452957872013-08-07T11:21:47.356-04:002013-08-07T11:21:47.356-04:00I've been thinking about this article and foll...I've been thinking about this article and following the comments for a week now. The issues of gender and sexuality in dance fascinate and trouble me. It's fascinating because an art form that is so generally accepted as "gay" is also one that strongly reinforces standard gender roles. And it's troubling because so often attempts to challenge the gender stigma in dance often do so by reinforcing heteronormativity.<br /><br />This is a more low brow example than ballet, but I think of Nigel Lythgoe on So You Think You Can Dance saying he wants to encourage more boys in dance, and in the next breath chastising dancers for not being masculine enough in their dancing. Or how that show loves to highlight when a male dancer has a girlfriend but keeps the lives of gay dancers invisible. (They've gotten a wee bit better on this after much criticism, but there's still this odd assumption of heterosexuality.) <br /><br />I worry that some attempts to make dance okay for boys do so by subtly saying that "it's okay because it's not gay." It's okay because look at these famous dancers who are straight. It's okay because it's just like football or some other sport. It's okay because he'll be so popular with all those girls. I wish it were simply okay because it's beautiful and expressive and some people are very good at it and love to do it and bring pleasure to others.<br /><br />I'm glad to read that ballet is trying to tone down the pink, because I think the gender pressures for girls are as strong, although different. <br /><br />Susan, have you looked into the work of Doug Risner? He writes fascinating stuff on gender, sexuality, and dance, and has done extensive scholarship looking specifically at boys in dance. I think you'd be interested in reading him. There are links to some of his writings here: http://www.dougrisner.com/html/about_publ.htm Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-32082860651299486732013-08-01T19:23:47.508-04:002013-08-01T19:23:47.508-04:00I was totally thinking of Billy Elliot when i was ...I was totally thinking of Billy Elliot when i was reading your post, Susan. Your son was lucky to have parents like you and your husband. I'm glad he stuck with it!<br /><br />My 4yr old daughter has been taking a ballet/tap/jazz class the last two summers. She loves it. Her dance studio offers free classes for brothers and half price if there isn't a sister enrolled. Obviously they are trying to encourage boy dancers. I am planning on signing my son up as soon as he's old enough, and I hope that he wants to do it for at least a few years. <br /><br />When I was in high school over 20yrs ago, there were two boys who did ballet--both actually went on to dance in the NYC ballet for awhile. they were both good looking and nobody ever gave them crap about dancing. The girls were all after them, too. <br />~KimberlyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-8092919307143689262013-08-01T10:23:43.550-04:002013-08-01T10:23:43.550-04:00Mattie is lucky to have Susan as a mom. We have as...Mattie is lucky to have Susan as a mom. We have as much to learn from her as we do from him! Thanks for this!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-32823128786572969472013-07-31T21:38:43.841-04:002013-07-31T21:38:43.841-04:00Dear Jungle Reds, thank you so much for having me ...Dear Jungle Reds, thank you so much for having me today! What a wonderful group of writers, women, and web hostesses! So, I closed my eyes and pointed and Lisa Alber is the winner of a FREE autographed copy of His Majesty's Hope! Rhys, how do I get Ms Alber's address?<br /><br />Thanks again, everybody! It was wonderful to meet you and hear your thoughts!<br /><br />xoxo SusanSusan Elia MacNealhttp://www.susaneliamacneal.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-77186248932889644992013-07-31T20:32:35.114-04:002013-07-31T20:32:35.114-04:00This really is the same issue as Maggie's - be...This really is the same issue as Maggie's - being limited by someone else's preconceived notion of how we are supposed to act based on our gender. <br /><br />I am glad that Mattie is going through the rough spots ok. He will soar no matter what he decides. cybele727https://www.blogger.com/profile/16336273913991459858noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-65169441855320318702013-07-31T20:12:15.827-04:002013-07-31T20:12:15.827-04:00No. No. No. This young man was not being hit with ...No. No. No. This young man was not being hit with "homophobia." He's being hit with SEXISM. The presumption that all male dancers are gay is DISCRIMINATION AGAINST MALE DANCERS, and is also SEXISM. <br /><br />This is important. Ask any woman athlete who's NOT a lesbian. Kell Brigannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-66776432526567483722013-07-31T19:20:07.906-04:002013-07-31T19:20:07.906-04:00In the South, in a small town, boys in dance - any...In the South, in a small town, boys in dance - any kind of dance - will be looked at as strange. I know because I have a friend who's son takes dance lessons and it is not an easy road for him. It has also been hard for my daughter Grace playing softball. They see a girl that hates pink, loves softball, and cannot fathom that she also loves Ian Somerhalder. How can a tomboy like guys?!? She's run into this more than once. Not easy at 12. Talking, talking, talking - and getting her to places she can meet/interact/talk with women that played softball successfully has made a huge difference. They each find their own passion, we help them as best we can. You're a great mom.Audra Rickmannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-15944174497011393292013-07-31T18:54:10.075-04:002013-07-31T18:54:10.075-04:00I remember taking my then six year old, loves-the-...I remember taking my then six year old, loves-the-limelight, son to a musical theater class... just to try it out before we made a year-long commitment. <br /><br />Shushed away by the teacher, I wasn't permitted to watch. Ninety minutes later I was anxious to hear his thoughts (check-book in hand)when the door swung open. <br /><br />Me: What did you think?!<br />He: It was okay.<br />Me: So you want to go back.<br />He: Nah.<br />Me: Why?<br />He: Too much singing and dancing.<br /><br />There you have it. For someone who always wanted to take dance as a child, this ended my first lesson in encouraging your children's (not your own)interests and listening when they are ready to veer in their own direction. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09756632888554410110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-50064309626926543862013-07-31T18:50:12.491-04:002013-07-31T18:50:12.491-04:00Gender roles are delineated in the public educatio...Gender roles are delineated in the public education system constantly. The most subtle, but pervasive form, is the use of "boys and girls" as a manner of addressing a group of children. Boys. And girls. It's loaded with subtext, yet it just rolls off the tongue...Daniellenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-38085053939499975302013-07-31T18:16:26.832-04:002013-07-31T18:16:26.832-04:00My daughter gets no grief for playing basketball o...My daughter gets no grief for playing basketball or any other sport but my son has been tormented for all kinds of derivations from the norm (all pretty minor, from my POV). Seems it's easier to be a tough girl than a gentle boy. I will share this with both of them. Thanks!Tilia Klebenov Jacobshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17481683937316185659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-550556402321652682013-07-31T18:02:14.783-04:002013-07-31T18:02:14.783-04:00Gaylen, what a lovely story, thank you for sharing...Gaylen, what a lovely story, thank you for sharing. And thank you everyone for sharing your stories!Susan Elia MacNealhttp://www.susaneliamacneal.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-33350265737113660132013-07-31T16:50:24.430-04:002013-07-31T16:50:24.430-04:00our son was also the only boy. he followed his sis...our son was also the only boy. he followed his sister into ballet. we could not keep him out of the classes. every week the teachers would walk him to the door after he had sneaked in and started to dance. this was before he was 3. they would not let him start until he was 3. he also attended sab. he is a professional ballet dancer now. he is brilliant. he was born to dance. very brave young man. endured so many horrible, awful things. we are very proud of him for his hard work and dedication. ballet makes you strong in many ways. we could not love him more. (not my real name - gaylen marie on fb)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-53799353585010705142013-07-31T16:35:41.661-04:002013-07-31T16:35:41.661-04:00Edith, thank you, I saw that! I'm honored.Edith, thank you, I saw that! I'm honored.Susan Elia MacNealhttp://www.susaneliamacneal.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-79200593322847998942013-07-31T15:32:56.356-04:002013-07-31T15:32:56.356-04:00Susan, Janet Reid quotes a few paragraphs from you...Susan, Janet Reid quotes a few paragraphs from your Churchill book today as an shining example of how to tell, not show, when you just have to!<br /><br />http://jetreidliterary.blogspot.com/2013/07/telling-it-well.htmlEdith Maxwellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01388006370860482509noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-5954546060031034132013-07-31T14:49:12.343-04:002013-07-31T14:49:12.343-04:00Susan and Matthew - I am so proud of both of you. ...Susan and Matthew - I am so proud of both of you. I know that there were hurdles to overcome, and there will be in the future. On the other hand, becoming a very strong and mature person will give Matthew a HUGE advantage in life. And he will be able to move in such a way that women will turn to admire his backside as he walks away. Just sayin'.ANNETTEhttp://www.letterswhichbuildbridges.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-62930747786633516672013-07-31T14:41:51.384-04:002013-07-31T14:41:51.384-04:00Yes, loved both First Position and Billy Elliott. ...Yes, loved both First Position and Billy Elliott. I think seeing those boys on screen really helped my son.Susan Elia MacNealhttp://www.susaneliamacneal.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-44456200681243621672013-07-31T14:11:22.068-04:002013-07-31T14:11:22.068-04:00I know you don't need strangers commenting on ...I know you don't need strangers commenting on your parenting, but your son is fortunate he's not being limited by the people who love him best, even with good intentions. <br /><br />Billy Elliot--totally great movie! I hope your son's dreams, like Billy's, come true.Ramonahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00627775403015684868noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-78190107588225634112013-07-31T14:09:11.404-04:002013-07-31T14:09:11.404-04:00Great post -- such an important message. I recent...Great post -- such an important message. I recently was going to a baby shower, and the couple is not revealing the baby's gender. <br /><br />I ordered something off their registry, but wanted a little outfit to wrap up and bring to the party. I went to a nice children's clothing store where the choices were PINK and BLUE, and nothing else!<br /><br />So many colors to choose from -- green & red & stripes & yellow! I finally found a white "onesie." <br /><br />I dressed my four daughters in basic crayon colors, and gave them a variety of toys. These days, they even make LEGO blocks gender- specific!!<br /><br />Ballet for boys and baseball for girls. Let's just do it.Denise Annhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02790883493798517829noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-12352627831307506492013-07-31T13:30:33.668-04:002013-07-31T13:30:33.668-04:00I am looking forward to reading your books,Susan! ...I am looking forward to reading your books,Susan! When I was about 5 or 6 my mother signed me up for ballet class, along with my best friend. I don't know whose idea that was. Not mine! I preferred playing cowboys and Indians, Superman, and so forth with my big brother. Anyway, it was doomed from the start. I am not a morning person now and was not one back then either. The classes were early in the morning and I HATED going to them. The big recital had all of us girls dressed like bunny rabbits skipping around the dance studio owner's son who was dressed as a carrot. He did all the dancing. I still cringe when I see a picture of me in that costume. Anyway I whined enough that Mom did not make me continue. And know what? I didn't miss it one bit!Pat Dnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-41999926220991845022013-07-31T12:59:52.703-04:002013-07-31T12:59:52.703-04:00Have you seen the wonderful documentary, FIRST POS...Have you seen the wonderful documentary, FIRST POSITION? It follows several young AMAZING male dancers. I can't recommend it highly enough.Robin Agnewnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-63021968573826494912013-07-31T12:59:21.730-04:002013-07-31T12:59:21.730-04:00No, I was never a ballet dancer myself. When I was...No, I was never a ballet dancer myself. When I was 22, I worked as an intern at Random House for the legendary editor Kate Medina. She was often too busy to use her New York City Ballet subscription tickets, so she'd sometimes give them to me. And I was blown away by what I saw on stage — Balanchine and Stravinsky most memorably. Just so amazing. I think for someone so involved with reading and writing and words, dance was a revelation — no words at all! And so I became a fan as an adult. Ultimately, I became an associate editor at Dance Magazine, one of my favorite jobs, ever.<br /><br />In Mr. Churchill's Secretary, I never meant to have Sarah Sanderson, the ballet dancer. She was never in my notes, or my outlines. But she was there when they all went to the Blue Moon Club and has become a big part of my fictional world. I'm happy to say that Sarah will be returning to Maggie Hope's life in a big way in novel #4, The Prime Minister's Secret Agent.<br />Susan Elia MacNealhttp://www.susaneliamacneal.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-7413930365859496342013-07-31T12:58:55.602-04:002013-07-31T12:58:55.602-04:00When my son was small, he wanted to take ballet li...When my son was small, he wanted to take ballet like his sister. Only in a small town, the teacher wouldn't take boys. Then a few years later, the son of a prominent family was accepted. One of the first "it's not fair" situations I had to try to explain. <br /><br />Pen M<br /><br />pmettert@yahoo.comAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-20156190644189618272013-07-31T12:56:11.617-04:002013-07-31T12:56:11.617-04:00Susan,
What a wonderfully touching story. Thank yo...Susan,<br />What a wonderfully touching story. Thank you so much for sharing. You and your husband are raising one amazing boy, who will grow up to be one amazing man. Kudos to both of you, and to him for having the courage to follow his convictions.<br />Cathleen Holsthttp://www.cathleenholst.webs.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-7882725879339483602013-07-31T12:49:31.132-04:002013-07-31T12:49:31.132-04:00Girls can face the same kind of prejudice. In our ...Girls can face the same kind of prejudice. In our sports-mad society (and I am a sports fan), ballet is seen as something cute with tutus that little girls do until they grow out of it. Often those girls are also on a soccer or other sports team. Parents who think nothing of bringing a child to practices 5 days a week and spend entire weekends dragging along siblings to out-of-town tournaments will pull their daughters from ballet because it is too time consuming to take them to ballet classes 2 3 times a week. My daughters danced ballet for many years, and their schoolmates would tease them for doing ballet, and exclude them because they weren't on a sports team. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1001156153899984046.post-21217000990365531382013-07-31T12:41:37.142-04:002013-07-31T12:41:37.142-04:00Great story! Great son! This story reminded me of...Great story! Great son! This story reminded me of when my now 26-year-old son was around 3 or 4. He would put on his older sister's swirly skirt and sing Oklahoma, providing much fun for him, his sister, and me. (I think his sister originally put it on him.) My mother-in-law learned of this bit of fun and suggested I ban my son from this activity, as it was not an activity a boy should be doing. I allowed him to continue twirling until he tired of it. Somehow, it didn't seem to damage him. LOL!Kathy Reelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17004247271452356577noreply@blogger.com