Monday, May 17, 2021

Us versus the Grizzly Bears - Who Wins?

 JULIA SPENCER-FLEMING: A couple days ago I saw a tweet about a survey done by YouGov.com asking the all-important question of today: Which wild or domesticated animals would take you to the cleaners in a fight, and which ones can you, an average American adult in the year 2021, totally beat?



My first thought at seeing this list is most Americans have NO idea the chimpanzees they see in movies and TV are babies. Adult chimps stand up to 5 ½ feet tall, weight up to 130 pounds, and the males have a set of long, scary canine teeth (in fact, humans are the only primates who don’t have these, a fact which I, as a parent who had to pay for braces, am grateful.) My second thought is - geese? Buddy , have you ever SEEN an angry goose? Note the survey people didn’t even put swans on the list. Swans will Mess You Up. If Swan Lake had been accurate, Prince Seigfried would have gotten his arm broken in the second act.


Then the pollsters separated the respondents by gender. And, unsurprisingly, that’s when things got even more interesting.



This one chart explains every single news story about a guy jumping into some zoo enclosure, most “Hey, y’all, look at this,” items, and the Darwin Awards. Almost one out of four American men think they can beat a King Cobra. Like… how? Are you going to whistle a snake charming tune like Hadji in Johnny Quest? 


Or how about the 38% of American men who believe they can beat an eagle? First off, punching an eagle in the face in unAmerican. Would Captain America punch a bald eagle? No. Captain America punches Nazis. Be like Captain America. 


Secondly, this is a bald eagle’s talons:


They’ve got a pair; one is called Freedom and the other is called Justice. Hell Yeah! And you’re going to go up against that, Kyle? I thought not. 


There’s a delightful near-equality of delusion in the percentage of men and women who think they can come out on top in an unarmed fight with a grizzly bear, lion or elephant. The Latin name for the North American brown bear is Ursus arctos horribilis. What do you think your chances are against a creature scientifically designated as horrible? I have a two part plan for if I’m ever in a position to be charged by a grizzly: 1) Don’t ever be anywhere near a grizzly bear 2) If you are near a grizzly, die. 


Reds, what do you think? Could you beat one of these critters in a fight? Do American men maybe have a “too much self confidence” problem? (Spoiler: yes.) (Although there was that guy who tossed a rabid bobcat to save his wife, so…) And why do 64% of women think they can beat a housecat without oven mitts and/or a towel? Have you never tried to pill a cat?


HANK PHILLIPPI RYAN: This is me, running. That’s my ONE-part plan. Run. Nobody could fight  off any of those big ones, that’s ridiculous.  I loved the bobcat tossing guy, though.


LUCY BURDETTE: I’m not taking any of those on either! Maybe I could charm a housecat or a medium sized dog, but that’s as far as I would take it…


 
RHYS BOWEN:  it’s the small dogs that are more aggressive  than big dogs.  Personally I wouldn’t take on a spider of more than half inch diameter.I have killed snakes when we lived in Texas, but only when I needed to protect my children. Likewise cockroaches but that’s about my limit. Geese scare me. Swans are vicious.

 

DEBORAH CROMBIE: Have any of these people ever looked at a rat’s teeth? Now look at the soft skin on your hands. Go from there. As for cats, maybe the calculus should include “beat with what degree of damage?” Or maybe they’ve never had cats. As for the gender difference, this makes me despair that humans will ever become any more evolved…


HALLIE EPHRON: I’m not taking any of them on. Because why would I, and besides I’d lose, and probably some bystander with a cell phone would memorialize it for posterity. You’ve got to wonder what genius dreamed up that survey in the first place. 

 

JENN McKINLAY: I'm tapping out at medium sized dog. Wildlife has the word "wild" in it for a reason. They can't be shamed like your dog or huff out of the room like your cat. They will carve out your heart with a talon or a claw and make lunchmeat out of you with no regrets. As they should if ever you tried to take them on.


JULIA: What do you think, dear readers? Could you take on a lion in a fight? How about a kangaroo? Or a wolf? Maybe we can start with Youngest's 14 year old blind and hard-of-hearing Shih Tzu and work our way up from there?

73 comments:

  1. No. Just . . . no.

    I am smart enough to know that I shouldn’t even think about fighting with any of them in the first place. [Of course, if it was to protect my children, that would be a completely different story . . . but, then, mamas protecting the Little Ones would have a huge advantage over any of those critters, now, wouldn’t they???]

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    1. Joan, I think that might be the ONLY time a human could beat many of those critters. Mothers protecting their children have performed amazing feats of strength, and been injured without feeling any pain until afterwards.

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  2. None of them. Just...none. My own house cat, maybe. Depending on his mood. All the responses in those tables are insane!

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    1. Edith, I can beat my housecat if I casually pet her while she's on the dresser in the bathroom, and then grab her neck fold and press her down with my elbow with lightening-like speed. That's how I give her her antihistamine squirt.

      BUT! She'll be wary for days afterwards (I usually have to enlist the Maine Millennial to help) and this is ONLY for liquid medicine. If it doesn't come in a liquid, I pay extra for the vet's office to take care of it. They're the pros.

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    1. Therein lies the rub, Dru - many of these animals can run a lot faster then we can over short distances. Time to start sprint training, I guess.

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    2. I found out, when I was at the senior grocery shopping hour last week and during checkout realized I'd forgotten the milk, that running is no longer in the cards for this former Boston Marathon (slow) finisher! But hey, I can speed walk with the best of 'em. ;^)

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    3. I'm trailing right behind you, Edith. With bad ankles and bad knees, running is no longer an option, even if I'm running for my life. I'm either gonna find a way to ease myself out of it, or die.

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    4. I'm with Gigi. A decent sprinter in my younger day, a fast walk is a challenge, now. Having been attacked by as Maine Coon, a rottweiler, chased by two angry geese, I'd find it necessary to avoid everything on the list.

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  4. When vacations in National Parks were a thing, we went to Glacier for a week of hiking, etc. Before we met our group, we treated ourselves to 2 nights in a famous lodge just outside of Whitefish. When we entered the lobby, TOWERING over our heads was a fully upright grizzly bear. Anyone who thinks it would even be a fight is nuts. This is not a time when Karate will come in handy.

    As for lions and elephants...then there is the infamous "home-raised" chimpanzee attack right here in Connecticut. Ghastly. I'm with Debs about the prospects for the human race.

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    1. Judy, I saw a similar Kodiak bear (as they call grizzlies in Canada) in the hotel lobby in Anchorage during Bouchercon 2007. It similarly... impressed me.

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    2. Julia, a Kodiak Bear is a separate kind of bear from a Grizzly. While both a subspecies of the Brown Bear, names are not interchangeable. The Kodiak Bear lives on the islands of the Kodiak Archipelago in Alaska. But those Kodiak are super huge! Never got to see one while living for two years on Kodiak Island, although neighbors did. All back slowly away ringing their Bear bells for all they were worth. Bears went one way, humans the other.

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  5. Ugh...that survey just further confirms people are just flat out stupid these days.

    Look, most people couldn't beat zombies, and those are FICTIONAL beings.

    You can't beat any of these natural world creatures if they are out to end you. They'll get you...and your little dog too.

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    1. Jay, thank you for my first smile of the morning...”and your little dog too.”

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    2. I'm with you, Jay, on the 'flat out stupid' comment about people these days. Sad but true.

      And also on your small dog comment: Late one night, I called the police because the old lady next door had left her dog out and that was highly unusual. I was concerned. The police came...and were almost kept off the property by the small dog barking his head off. They tried to get around it, but somehow couldn't. Eventually, the old lady came to the door to see what the ruckus was about. All's well that ends well.

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    3. Jay, laughing at "your little dog, too!"

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  6. I have been near kangaroos, some much more taller than me with a lot of muscles. No way I would fight one.
    For any animal of this survey, I am among those who would run.

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    1. And your answer, Danielle, is why the human race has survived to this day. "Run!!!"

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  7. I agree with Julia about geese. They can be vicious, coming right at you especially at this time of year with the new goslings to protect. But Canada geese are protected species under the Migratory Birds Convention Act in Canada so you can't harm them.

    After reading C.J. Box's DARK SKY (Joe Pickett #21), I would have added WOLVERINES among the top wild animal to not tangle with. That scene with Joe in the cave was two of them was terrifying.

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    1. Grace, we get a lot of Canada geese here in Maine, as you might suspect, and they dwell alongside the rest of us quite peaceable as long as they're not provoked or, as you note, think their goslings are threatened.

      But OH MY GOD the goose poop everywhere. I know a lot of otherwise ecology-minded people who really, really wish they could shoot a goose.

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  8. Er, are those people NUTS? Evade and avoid, maybe, fight, I don't think so. This time of year I won't go into my own woods alone. You may not see the mama bear, but she will see you. Anyone else humming teddy bear's picnic?

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    1. I think that's part of the problem, Kait - some of these bear encounters-gone-wrong stem from folks not being able to discern teddy bears from the real deal. I mean look at that black bear, it's so plush and chubby...

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  9. As Jenn said, "wildlife" contains the word "wild." I don't think I'm nimble enough to take on any of these creatures. I was chased by an angry goose as a child and it scarred me for life. And I don't think any of them fight by Marquess of Queensbury rules.

    Those who say they can take a bald eagle have clearly never seen any bird of prey, much less an eagle.

    And as the owner of a big dog (80lbs and 30" tall) who lives next to two small dogs (maltese-poodle mixes), I can tell you who is more aggressive.

    Man is a fairly puny animal. There is a reason our ancestors developed weapons.

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    1. That was exactly what I said to my daughter when I showed her the survey, Liz. It was our big advantage right from the beginning - Homo habilis used chipped stone tools two and a half MILLION years ago. Big brains, tools, and the ability to work cooperatively - that's what we've got. And your big brain isn't going to be of much help if it's just you, alone and unarmed, against an enraged Malti-poo.

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  10. I blame movies and TV for this kind of insanity. And for making people think they can be Rambo if they have enough weapons and ammo around. All those special effects just feed delusional hero fantasies.

    So in case you couldn't tell, none of these! I'm with Rhys on the half-inch or less spider fighting.

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    1. recently we rewatched a Marvel movie with the Black Widow, and I actually found myself thinking, "Maybe if I went to the Y and worked out regularly, I could do some of that cool stuff." Then I realized I couldn't even get up from the sofa without my knees complaining. Movies DO make us delusional!

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  11. Very amusing in the reading, but I'll leave it at that, thank you very much!

    Last summer, the black bears were much in evidence at our cottage. The first time I saw one, I was inside looking out through the dining room window. Val, I yelled. There's a bear outside! She, being quite unlike me, roared out to the back deck and heaved some of my small-stone collection at the creature who was trying to get at the bird feeder (our mistake to have it up, anyway). The stones did nothing to scare the bear, but she or he did lumber off. From then on, the birds went hungry at our place and the cat went out supervised only.

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    1. Amanda, I sometimes think the only reason North America isn't populated solely by bears is that they are, by and large, extremely nonaggressive. If bears got as ticked off as humans regularly do, we'd be in trouble.

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    2. Julia, have you seen the videos posted online of black bears enjoying the hot tub at various cabins? Just chillin',

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    3. Flora, most bears remind me of big shaggy California guys. They just want to hang in nature, eat some organic grubs and berries, and peace out.

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  12. Crazy! I like to think I am smart enough not to tangle with any of those! I'm guessing most of the people who answered those questions had no real idea of what the animals were; maybe they had been watching too many cartoons.

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  13. Our first cat appeared around the corner of the house one afternoon. Murphy was an independent guy--came and went as he pleased, scrapped with the barnyard bullies occasionally. My teenage nephew and I once tried to subdue him in order to take him to the vet after one such incident. Ha! You can guess who won--Murphy 1, Aunt Flora and nephew 0. So, no, I'm not taking on any critter. My plan is to be aware of my surroundings and stay out of areas where I'm likely to encounter anything on the list, especially with 'wildlife' attached to its species. And geese? I ALWAYS gave my grandma's flock a wide berth.

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    1. Our vet says cats are the worst (for getting humans injured) because they have no compunctions about doing anything and everything to keep from getting grabbed and worked on. Domesticated, properly-cared-for dogs won't go whole ham on their owners or familiar humans. Which is good, because their bites are SERIOUS.

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    2. Oh, and I wanted to add: my dear friend had a couple barn cats she wanted to get fixed and inoculated. She wound up using a Have-a-heart trap!

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    3. I had a cat with West African genes who was usually sweet but did NOT like shots. Hey, I warned the vet...

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    4. Vets are not paid enough for what they do, Edith.

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  14. I'm aware of the usual suspects like the growling, lunging, ferocious German Shepherd Dog down the street my female standard poodle told off in thirty seconds (he whimpered and skulked away). And the occasional sightings of garter snakes in a mating ball or one of the local coyotes at dawn, strolling down the middle of the street. May is snapping turtle month, so I steer clear of certain areas where they travel to lay eggs. Awareness is all.

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    1. I laugh, Margaret, because . . . I always had male dogs, until I got my Zoe. Thinking a female dog would be a better companion for my sweet, shy male, Tam, I got a 50 border collie girl. And let me tell you, we all now bow to her and call her Sheriff Zoe, the Lawgiver. Turns out female dogs can be real b--. Well. you know.

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    2. I had the same experience with Penny Lane, def the alpha bit** around here. And I though I was.

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    3. Yes, I've known more than one pair of dog friends where the female was definitely No. 1.

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  15. Run! Just RUN!! I don’t trust anything that’s not ME! My very congested suburban neighborhood has been visited in recent years by foxes, coyotes, wild turkeys, deer, bobcats, etc. A couple of years ago a doe was killed by a bobcat in front of a nearby building in my condo complex. I keep my eye out even when I’m merely walking to the dumpster for my building.

    DebRo

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    1. DebRo, that must have been a hell of a big bobcat! I'd be careful, too!

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  16. Back in the day when I still went into the office, we shared our building in Dallas' Fair Park with a Birds of the World show during the State Fair of Texas. There were a lot of raptors in the Birds of the World cast, including a young female Bald Eagle who was stationed near the stairs leading into the building. You're worried about their talons, Julia? Don't ignore that beak! She would size us up for lunch potential every time we walked past. No way would I fight her, or any of the critters on this list.

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    1. I know, right? Guys in the Twitter thread I read were saying, "Well, bird bones are very light - one good strike to the chest and you could disable an eagle." And I'm thinking, Dude, do you really believe you're going to be able to get close enough to throw a punch?

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    2. And that list didn't even include nesting Mockingbirds. Those beloved songbirds might be small, but man! Don't go near their nests!

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  17. I wouldn't take any of them on -- unless I needed to protect a child. Then I'd take one for the team.

    Back in the day I used to take my lunch and park up by Irondequoit Bay. There was one enormous white goose that I named Everett. He would come up, tap on my car window and beg for bits of my lunch. Yes, he was that tall. Later one spring I saw him with a pair of Canadian geese and their goslings. Oddly enough one or two of the babies was white. All three adults supervised the children. Ménage a trois? Of course.

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    1. The animal world is a LOT more flexible in its relationships than certain humans would like to believe... ;-)

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  18. Julia, I am thinking about these grizzly bears. It was their home before the settlers took away their land. I would not take any of these animals on -- unless I needed to protect a child.

    There have been mysteries where wild animals are accused of killing someone when the real culprit is a human killer.

    Diana

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    1. Diana, I've seen that plot at least once in a TV series!

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  19. I'm not taking on anything! Hiking? Be sure your companion is slower than you. Don't be the throw down person. Truly, I would never tangle with anything wild unless a child was in danger. Our big city had the loose tiger last week, 8 month old baby, but still. . . Coyotes. Alligators. Snakes. All kinds of insects. There was even a video posted a few years ago of a baby king cobra wriggling its way down a hallway of an apartment building downtown. What idiot would keep that for a pet? Looking at the graph, I see more proof of why women outlive men.

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    1. Pat, I see that graph as illustrating the balance that's led to humans spreading across all sorts of landscapes. We need women to keep everyone (especially the children) alive, and men so someone can experiment with, "Is this crustacean edible?" and "What happens when I get on this log and float down the river?"

      Of course, the female specialty is still very much in need, while figuring out what happens when we do ridiculously reckless stuff is... less so.

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  20. Okay, I had some technical difficulties with this post, and i just managed to get the YouTube clips to work, so if you haven't seen the goose scaring off TWO TIGERS and the family trapped by their own cat, go ahead and take a peek. (Literally. Through your fingers.)

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  21. My golly.... I am constantly wondering anew why the stupid gene has not yet died out.

    And as for the proviso "Unarmed" combat, I kind of think that's exactly what these hero types could soon be. Unarmed.

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  22. Glad to see we are a sensible bunch! Maybe we should do a little match-making--a guy who thinks he could take out a bear with the lady who put gasoline in plastic bags...

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  23. The only dogs that have ever bitten me were a former neighbor's Yorkshire terriers. And in my own yard! Vicious little ankle biters!

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    1. It's the little ones that'll get you. I figure when 90% of the world is larger than you, you need to sport some attitude.

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    2. I know that feeling! As the youngest and shortest in her class forever, I had to stand up for myself.

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    3. Edith, thank for this afternoon’s smile! Imagination painting a picture of you biting classmates on the nether regions. LOL.

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  24. I'm dead. If any of them attack me, I'm dead.

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  25. Just got back from the dog's long afternoon walk, and I realized I can barely hold my own against ticks, and that's with all the animals loaded up with Frontline.

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  26. Run, Forrest, run! I can empathize with that tiger being chased by the goose. I experienced being chased by a goose as a child, and I barely made it in my aunt's back door. Scared me into a lifetime of respect for geese. Of course, I realized after that I had gotten to close to your babies, but the fierceness with which Mother Goose came after me was a lesson never forgotten.

    I was surprised to see that more women thought they could take on a lion successfully. Have these people not seen the movie with Michael Douglas and Val Kilmer, The Ghost and the Darkness. Apparently, these people not afraid of lions only remember Born Free. The advice I just saw on Google about a lion charging you (aka attacking you) is not to run, but to stand your ground and wave your arms above your head, all the while shouting as loud as you can (I wonder if screaming as loud as you can counts). You should also throw anything you might have at hand at the lion. Well, lets hope none of us has to ever follow this advice.

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    1. Hugh Laurie told a story on the Graham Norton Show once, about filming a scene with a lion. When he asked the trainer what he should do if the lion charged, the trainer told him "reach back, grab a handful of sh** and throw it in the lion's face." When Laurie asked him where he would find the shit, the trainer said, "Don't worry. It will be there."

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    2. Gigi, pretty sure it would be in my case...

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  27. I find it funny that this came up today since I'm reading Stuart Gibbs's newest FunJungle book (middle grade mystery). So far today, the characters have survived a grizzle bear in the house and a bison stampede.

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    1. It's always easier in fiction, isn't it? :-)

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    2. It is easier in fiction. But they also had weapons, there were more of them, and it was clear they were in danger. And the book is mocking the idiots who think that you can get close to the wild animals in National parks for pictures without consequences.

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  28. We had an orphaned bobcat kit come in at the wildlife rehab center I volunteered at. He was small enough to fit in one hand (disclaimer: don't hold a baby bobcat in your hand) and we had to put him in a plastic storage tub with air holes while we set up his run. The owner weighted the lid with two concrete bricks. Within five seconds flat, the bobcat had made its way out. The wee kit was so fierce that if you walked by its run, it would jump up on the levelled shelves and throw itself at the wire, hissing, growling, and trying to kill you. Don't mess with bobcats, no matter how tiny they are! *laugh*

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